Dear Future Guardian,
I need to revisit an idea.
Something we've talked about before.
Something which I've "fixed" about myself and my life before.
But as we know, you never really "fix" yourself. You never "arrive." You don't just install "The Champion's Mind1" and then that's it, you win.
Life is not about “getting there.” It’s about the path. And along the path you’re never always completely perfect.
Rather,
You’re always getting off center.
Always coming back to center.
(And if you think about it, does The Champions Mind exist without The Human Mindset? ... you can't be centered if there's no off center)
For me, what I'm about to explore is one those concepts which changes as I change. (Really, that's everything, and if the meaning of something changes for you, what THAT means is you've grown and are applying that idea into your life, observing what happens, and changing your behavior because of it)
Karpman's Drama Triangle.
We've published about this before multiple times, and it's a component within our core principles, so as you dig through understanding yourself and your life, you'll eventually run into it.
I'll briefly go over Karpman's in a moment.
The reason for revisiting this today is twofold.
One, I've had some recent experiences that have me seeing and understanding Karpman's in a new light (different river different person). Conveniently I have two situations going on, one where I've aggressively put myself (not really consciously) into the triangle in a specific role, and a different one where I was aggressively pulled into that role (again, not really consciously).
In reflection, realizing that it's all well and good to say "don't play the victim," "don't be the savior," (obviously don't be the persecutor) ... but what's compelling to me this time around is the observations of the downline effects of participating in this triangle, AND perhaps some useful tools in both avoiding getting into it as well as getting out of it.
So I think. As usual, I don't really know what I think until I see what I say, so we'll see what I think (for now) by the end of all this.
Karpman's Drama Triangle
Let's just start off by quoting from The Adaptive Dilemma2:
"Karpman’s Drama Triangle suggests that there are three roles that need to be filled for drama to start, continue, and compound.
The Victim - Says “I’m helpless”. Oftentimes, they are completely unaware they are playing the role of the victim, which is why thinking deeply about your language is so important.
More on that shortly.
The Rescuer – Says “Let me save you.” The rescuer is the “savior”. They are generally the most dangerous of the three.
In an attempt to avoid their own problems - but still feel productive - they seek other people to rescue.
The rescuer will carry people that are capable of learning how to walk on their own. This effectively cripples those people for life - and the rescuer will pat themselves on the back for it.
In order for the rescuer to maintain their position, they need someone to rescue -a victim. In order for there to be a victim, there needs to be a villain.
The Persecutor.
Don’t get us wrong, there are absolutely nefarious people - real villains. But the reality is that most “villains” are made up. Strangely, not by the victim but by the rescuer.
The rescuer needs the victim to remain a victim, or else they have to face their own problems.
One person can (and will) often rotate through all three roles, depending on which one allows them to avoid their own issues or best serves them at the time."
In The Adaptive Dilemma, that article continues to suggest that you can avoid being stuck in the perpetual drama triangle by the following
1. Refuse to rescue people that are capable of helping themselves.
2. Stop victimizing yourself.
Which is good advice.
But it also lacks the nuance of personal context and experience. Not to say that it is not helpful. It's that very lesson which set me down this path, and so now I'm going to attempt to bring it full circle.
The Victim.
The Savior.
The Persecutor.
Among other things one of the greatest dangers, in my personal observation, of The Drama Triangle, is being pulled into it without conscious awareness - whether that's by my own action and drive (as I have mentioned in the past, an inclination towards "Saviorism"), or as I have recently discovered, by someone else's drive to pull me in.
As much as you can try to consciously continuously check myself and see if I’ve put myself (or just ended up) in these situations in life, I think sometimes getting there can be subtle, and sometimes I can find myself so unconsciously desperate for something that I ignore the cold external light of rational perspective to see what's happening.
(See “The Danger of Needing to Feel”3)
Unfortunately, the impact of participating in or being stuck in the triangle can be far reaching, and potentially tremendously damaging, especially within personal relationships where the impacts of the dynamic can lead to loss of the relationship, but where your drive to not lose the relationship causes you to push in further and actually thus continue increasing the problematic dynamic.
That probably sounds confusing.
I'm going to start with the business example - because I have a recent client project which really threw all this into light for me. The thing about the client relationship dynamic which differs from the personal, is that I don't have a deep emotion and identity tie to such relationships - if they go bad either the client leaves or I do, and that's fine in those situations.
So I think this will be easier to explore first.
Business Drama Triangle
I talked about this a little bit in “What Is Your Role?”4. There I admitted to one of my flaws being a tendency towards "saviorism."
While I recognized A problem with this, I didn't really fully comprehend the reality or the impact of putting myself in "The Savior" role - at least not as I see it now.
My original view and treatment of this was simply, "be aware and don't try to be the savior."
That's all well and good,
But it's also not that easy nor is it that clear-cut.
The Savior, it turns out, is such a tempting role in business. And I don't mean overtly. I'm not sitting here salivating at the opportunity to "become a savior" or to sell myself as one. Rather as soon as I realize that's what I'm leaning towards, it sends of alarm bells and I can typically back out or reframe.
The temptation is a subtle one which, if I don't actively realize the role I'm falling into, can pull me in all the way, quite aggressively, and to great long term detriment.
I have a client.
This client came to me, and I realized they saw me as a solution to their problems. I did what I have (for the past couple years) consistently done to mitigate problems like this, which is I tried to convince them not to hire me. It's all to easy to take money from people who already want to hire me when I don't have the full context to understand what it is we're even going to do - but since I'm oriented towards actually solving problems and coming up with valuable long term solutions, I'd rather convince people NOT to hire me, than to hire me (and that way if they still want to work together, it's far more likely a better situation).
(Context: this is an email project, their former email strategy was not so much a strategy as it was a haphazard effort of disparate broadcasts all attempting to get the entire list to buy everything available all the time - this had caused most of the list to quickly ignore them, which resulted in some spam problems)
I told them the solution to their problem was unclear and couldn't be predicted, because we lacked a lot of behavioral data due to the way things had ended up (very few people reading/clicking). I explained what I'd do, but also that given their current situation, there was an extreme degree of uncertainty and a lack of data which could tell us what would most likely happen in the short term.
They convinced me they were in it for the long term - that they believed in and wanted the plan I'd outlined (which was basically R3MAIL5).
We began the work. The inevitable uncertainty hit ... and everything started to fall apart.
Details are not important,
What I realized is this.
When I came into this situation I was - unconsciously - stepping into a dynamic where one person was effectively being the victim to a problem and seeking a savior. There were problems they didn't understand, that they couldn't really see fully, and perhaps even because they couldn't see or understand the problems, instead of trying to take ownership of those they took the victim role instead.
And more important perhaps than my belief in the role I was taking (whether or not I willingly chose to step in as a savior), THAT is how they saw me.
I can look back on many client projects and see that this is a repeated and common pattern - Even when I actively try to eschew the "savior" role ...
And why wouldn't it be?
If you are a freelancer, service provider, someone going in and "solving problems," then almost by definition you are stepping into a scenario where the person you are solving problems for is playing the victim of that problem.
This isn't always the case, as I'll try to unfold shortly, but I want to finish my newfound perspective and thought here.
(Also, I can see that my best clients haven't had this dynamic)
First, on why this is so tempting.
Here's a little dark manipulation for you.
When someone sees you as, and believes you to be, the savior of their problems ... not only is it much easier to sell to them, but they may go to the extensive length of convincing you to let them hire you.
That's why one of the most common direct response marketing tactics is to pick a villain to pit yourself against with your audience.
Because it makes them the Victim and you The Savior.
The problem with the roles in the drama triangle is that each one is effectively offloading responsibility of different aspects of the drama to another point of the triangle.
The Savior is letting go of responsibility to determine whether the course of action is right or wrong for anyone else by justifying that they are saving the victim from The Persecutor (and to follow the marketing example, 'if the Victim would just do the work as The Savior says, they'd be saved!') - also, as we've discussed in the past, The Savior is often trying to save others because they can't figure out how to save themselves.
The Victim is letting go of responsibility of understanding their problem at all, and in determining the best course of action (and understanding that action) for solving their problem because the savior is there to save them.
So in embracing The Savior, The Victim gets to accept a false sense of security (and gets to shed responsibility) that all their problems are now solved!
When they likely don't even really understand what their problem is.
Furthermore,
Someone who is entrenched in a role in the triangle is highly internally incentivized to prove and justify the role that they have taken.
The Victim, if they really are fully embedded in that role, is going to have a driving need to justify that their position in that role is valid. And is there an easier way to validate your Victimhood than to find A Savior to validate your Persecutor?
The Savior, for that matter, needs the victim to remain the victim. (Which is kind of twisted if you think about it)
That's all just the beginning!
Because the drama triangle doesn't go away.
Here's the missing piece I didn't ever realize when it came to the dangers of being The Savior (or really either of these roles).
When you are entering into a scenario where the people involved are accepting roles in The Drama Triangle, THAT dynamic won't change. They are going to always be seeking to validate the role they see themselves in, whether consciously or unconsciously.
So,
If you enter into a client relationship taking on The Savior role (whether you consciously or willingly accept that, or it's thrust upon you by the other person who is entrenched in The Victim role and is driven to claim you as The Savior), as soon as shit doesn't go as expected ... The Victim could so very easily now see YOU as The Persecutor.
After all, if you are suddenly NOT The Savior, but you are existing in this triad, who else could you become, to them?
And if you are trying to be The Savior to your Victim client ... you're inclination is going to be to keep them a victim.
This all really has nothing to do with business. Everything I've said so far matches dynamic for dynamic with personal drama triangles.
If in a personal relationship you take on The Savior role for your Victim, and you aren't able to save them, they stop seeing you as The Savior, how are they most likely to naturally treat you?
What is that going to do to your relationship?
This is getting a little close to dogmatism. I've done no scientific studies. This is all just my personal lived experience and observation of both myself and other people being in and also not being in situations involving The Drama Triangle.
Going back to my client situation, the dynamic I outlined above, perfectly matches with the way events unfolded.
I became The Persecutor, to them.
Unfortunately ... the only way I've been able to resolve the problem, in the short term, is to redefine who The Persecutor is. I didn't even do this consciously. It was a snap response "no that's not the problem, this is the problem you're fighting against." I may very well be back in "The Savior" role. It may be that with this particular person there's no way to NOT be in that role and do this work.
It may be that my better solution, which I’ll outline in a moment below, will end the project altogether.
After all, I can't control whether other people have chosen to make themselves a Victim and abdicate responsibilities.
But, in considering how this has all unfolded, I do see how I can better recognize when that is happening, to actively reject The Savior role, and to build bumpers that keep me from being impacted when The Victim inevitably decides I'm no longer The Savior.
You might argue, don't go into business with Victims.
And honestly, I think when possible that's the best choice. But sometimes that's not always a reasonable choice to make, depending on the circumstances.
And sometimes you get into the situation without realizing it.
Sometimes you can get into an arrangement with A Victim, not realizing you are The Savior and everything is going great! Then, down the road, even in the face of everything going objectively well, they might start treating you like The Persecutor anyway out of nowhere.
Why?
Well.
Just as much as The Victim needs The Savior to justify their existence against The Persecutor ... they also need The Persecutor to justify their existence.
So
What happens, as The Savior, if you completely vanquish The Persecutor?
I'll let that sit with you.
And if YOU need to be The Savior to the person who needs to be The Victim ... god help you. Because you're real goal is going to end up maintaining their Victimhood as long as you need to be their Savior. And that's kinda F@#$ed up
Personal Drama Triangle
Maybe after all that I don't need to explore the dynamic from The Personal Drama Triangle perspective.
But we can talk more about those downline impacts.
Ever get into a situation in a relationship where it feels like your always at odds and fighting about something and you're thought is "I'm only trying to help you!"?
Nuances of the potential dynamics at play there aside ...
If you are inserting yourself into the role of The Savior, then you intentionally create the Drama Triangle Trap in your relationship. Now, as long as you don't consciously acknowledge what's happening and de-tangle yourself from the dynamic you will be trapped in it with this person.
You will fight to maintain them as The Victim, and something else as The Persecutor.
They may eventually see you as The Persecutor.
And all of that may happen without any of you realizing what's going on ... it just may show up as bad tumultuous conflicting relationship dynamics - where it feels like both of you have suddenly become the enemy of each other.
I'll leave it all to your imagination and personal experience to figure out what THAT looks like.
So perhaps we can move on and figure out how to better avoid and even maybe detangle from the dynamic.
To escape the trap.
A Point on Problems
First, I want to acknowledge a dynamic which I keep seeing throughout all this.
I think often times the Drama Triangle snaps into play because there is an actual authentic problem. There's a problem, and you end up trapped in The Triangle because someone is actually giving up responsibility and power.
But just because there ARE problems, does not mean you have to be in the drama triangle.
You me be an actual Victim to an actual Persecutor.
You can't control when something negative is happening to you, but that doesn't mean you need to accept the Victim role in the triangle. You can still identify what the problems are, what you have available in front of you, what your immediate constraints are, and move forward without relying on there always being a savior or always being a persecutor.
Its not always the Victim who creates the triangle.
Just as much as someone might try really hard to be and justify being The Victim, creating A Savior and locking in the triangle, someone else can try really hard to be and justify being The Savior, locking someone into being Victim.
Avoiding the Drama Triangle - Business Edition
Let me start this with the business example and my personal observations.
If I can be cognizant of being put into "The Savior" role by someone else ... whether that's recognizing they are playing The Victim or identifying me as a Savior ... I can actively work against this.
First, how can I recognize it?
I think the answer is - Adoption of "The Persecutor" in language.
If the prospect or client is speaking of someone else who's done a bad job or screwed them over, or something else which is causing all of their problems, that could be a sign of externalizing responsibility - a habit of the victim. It's not my fault it's this way, it's the bad man over there, and can you save me from the bad man?
It's that old adage of, if your prospect/client is always complaining about how their last contractor sucked ... how's that really gonna go for you?
This might be easier to see with the self awareness of actively looking for it, but I think polarization is so prevalent in marketing that it's just normal that people have problems and broken shit which needs fixing, and it's because of someone or something else that the problem exists or the thing is broken (that sort of manipulative marketing will do a really good job of making you believe YOU'RE not the problem, because, as is pointed out, that makes it so much easier to make money off you).
Turns out, you can have problems, and take full responsibility for those problems, even if you don't know what they are (taking responsibility for lacking the understanding as well).
Signs that someone is identifying something or someone else as their Persecutor is a sign that they may be playing The Victim role, and if both of those are true and they are trying to get you involved ... they might just be pulling you into The Savior.
Now, if I'm in the situation and didn't realize I got into it, perhaps one of the surefire ways to tell is if you quickly shift from "you're solving my problems everything is great" to "you're the problem!"
In other words, if the person is so entrenched in the Victim role, they HAVE to always have a Persecutor and a Savior ... and if you aren't The Savior, what do you become?
Another perspective, just thinking about this now ...
If you've hired someone to fix your problems and they see themselves as a Savior, they will fight to maintain you as Victim, perhaps constantly trying to convince you that there is or are other Persecutors out there trying to get them. A little food for thought if you're on the receiving end from a Savior.
Now, what do you do about it?
Before hand. You can always walk away.
This is probably the most healthy option. But sometimes, you really need to take that trip to the river, and this is what the river is giving you in the moment (ref - trips to the river6).
If I can identify that the other person sees an external force as "The Persecutor" (the thing causing them problems), and they see me as the solution to those problems, perhaps it's enough to call it out directly and make it clear. Take away the legs of "The Persecutor."
An example: Let's say I've got a prospect who wants to bring me in to help with their email strategy, and their big issue is the last person built something that really screwed things up for them. They might be playing the victim to that Persecutor looking for me as their savior.
I can call that out. "I can't tell that what they did is wrong. Clearly something isn't working for you, but it might not be anything they did. I have nothing to do with them and their work. Here's how I do things. If you want to go in this direction, that's a separate issue, but I can't come in and save you."
Even if, it could be true that the previous person's setup made things worse ... there's a reason that person came in and did that work, and "The Victim" in this case must hold responsibility for that happening. (In other words, there's a ton of context you can never see)
Of course, this is speculative. I'm just coming up with this right now.
But at the very least it seems reasonable that if I cut the legs off the perceived Persecutor ... then it should be much harder to make me The Savior (especially if I'm actively trying to not take that role). And if I actively reject their perception of The Persecutor and they fight back insisting that they are The Victim and only I can save them ... well ... I'll at the very least have a crystal clear understanding of the dynamic.
And if that makes it harder to sell ... if I drive someone away because I reject their Persecutor and tell them I'm not their Savior --- I can't see that as anything other than a better outcome.
Now ...
What about The Personal Drama Triangle?
Just like in the business situation, it really actually comes down to language, shared language, and clarity of understanding what's going on.
I can't think of any better solution to discovering you are in a personal drama triangle situation than saying "hey, looks like were in this drama triangle, and I've created that by trying to be The Savior - but you don't need that from me."
I find often times in life that there's little that is more powerful than complete personal awareness in the present moment. Being in the here and now and saying "this is how it really is." You've got to be willing to admit your failures, your vulnerabilities, and step forward into some unknown to resolve the dynamics.
If you've taken on - whether consciously or unconsciously - The Savior role, you've got to be willing to let go and let be what is, and perhaps even look inward to attend to your own shit which may be driving that dynamic in you.
Again, this is all speculative.
But if you stay Trapped in The Triangle in a personal relationship, it's only inevitably going to go bad for everyone.
Remember, even if you vanquish The Persecutor ... because you're trapped in The Triangle, they need to remain the Victim, you need to remain The Savior, and one way or another you're going to justify your existence until you can acknowledge that fault and de-tangle yourself from it.
Be Useful. Be Present. Love the Journey.
Joseph Robertson, CMO The Guardian Academy
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Karpman’s Drama Triangle reveals unique nuances
Never thought of Karpman's Drama Triangle through the lens of a business owner. Brilliant and helpful. Thank you, sir!